Because Honor and Profit is huge, we broke this up into two parts. You can find the first part here!
Chris: Starting off, we have the new Jinteki IDs. When I first saw Harmony Medtech, my first thought was that it was supposed to be the core of some kind of Jinteki fast-advance strategy. But upon further reflection, I think it is actually best as the core of a trap deck. Jinteki is at their scariest when it is down to the match point, and the runner is forced to make unsafe runs to block anything that might be a game-winning agenda. By forcing that phase of the game earlier than normal, Harmony Medtech plays right into one of Jinteki’s core strengths.
Brian: You touched on this aspect but I want to highlight it: This ID puts incredible pressure on the Runner to do things that are not good. The Corp is on 4 points, are you not going to run on click 4 just because people have said you shouldn’t when the game is on the line? Install, Advance, Advance also becomes A LOT more threatening.
I recently played against a Medtech deck that featured 3 Scorched Earth. It flatlined me on turn 2 because why is a Medical company nuking my house?!?.
I agree that this isn’t necessarily the Jinteki fast advance ID. There is a lot more to it.
I give this ID 4 out of 5 Net Damage.
Chris: Nisei Division. The “wacky” corp ID. I’ll say right now, I don’t know if this will actually be effective. But I suspect it will prove to be a fun one at least. With all the new Psi cards showing up, it’s cool to have a corp ID that supports them. Caprice Nisei didn’t really need any help, but it will be fun to see if this actually makes Snowflake (or, dare I hope, Bullfrog?) into cards that people actually put into their decks on purpose!
Brian: I wish we had 1 or 2 more decent Psi Ice to go along with this ID. Snowflake goes from an OK card to pretty good with this ID but where is the code gate and sentry? (Bullfrog doesn’t count)
This ID gets between 0 and 2 credits from me.
Chris: Jinteki has some of the most interesting IDs in the game, and this one is definitely up to par. It really forces the runner to play in a way that they don’t want to. Do they make reckless runs into unknown Jinteki servers? Or do they hold back, and give the corp the benefit of a free credit + click every round? I’m hoping that this ID starts to usher in a strange, Jinteki version of the popular fast-advance decks that NBN and HB currently enjoy, but who knows? If nothing else, it’s nice to finally have at least one situation where you could plausibly play woodcutter and have it be worthwhile…
Brian: I love this ID! Although I still don’t think Woodcutter is worth including. Note that unlike RP, the Runner must get a Successful Run in order to avoid the free advancement. A card you should consider is Successful Demo. This unpopular econ card is really useful in cases where you can keep the Runner out of the server but it is going to cost you most of your econ. Rez that Hadrian’s wall, put a free advancement on it, and then demonstrate success to get your money back!
Tennin is awarded 10 Unsuccessful Runs.
Chris: Jinteki Agendas! This one is a doozy. Being able to guarantee net damage during a run is a pretty big deal, and even if you can only use it once per run, this still cuts down the runner’s safety margin by quite a bit. Sadly, (read: thankfully) the timing doesn’t work out to turn Psychic Field into an insta-kill. On the other hand, the timing DOES work out to turn an unbroken Komainu into a flatline, so getting even one of these on the board is pretty significant. And at 3-cost, that’s something that shouldn’t be too hard to pull off. This card also becomes downright terrifying when comboed with either Tori Hanzo, or the Jinteki Chronos Protocol ID, assuming it wins.
Brian: This is one of those game changing agendas. Once this is scored, it changes the way the runner has to play the game. If they have an important card in hand, they now need to consider playing it before running. Running at 4 cards may not be enough. As you mentioned, it combos pretty great with other cards as well. PE will really love this card but any ID has a use for it.
This one gets 3 guaranteed Net Damage from me.
Chris: This agenda has a lot of people excited, and rightly so. Even if you can’t use it until the end of the game, the mere threat of a 2 point agenda, which you can score straight out of hand, is pretty major. Obviously combos pretty well with Harmon Medtech, but there are probably some fun strategies also, involving pulling these out with Fast Track, and storing them in your hand full of traps.
Brian: The first Breakthrough is a great candidate for Mushin No Shin or standard Install, Advance, Advance play. If you score it, cool, 2 points. If the runner steals it, cool, you now have a 3 for 2 and 2 for 2 waiting in your deck. This agenda is basically Jinteki’s second 3 for 2 so I suspect we will see more FA Jinteki decks soon.
My rating on this card is 1 less than yours.
Chris: I view this card as something of an apology, honestly. It’s like Lukas is saying – “Hey Jinteki. Sorry you didn’t get any good 3/2 agendas like everyone else, before we realized that 3/2 agendas were a bad idea and stopped printing them. So have one more, for old times sake. You only get one per deck, but don’t worry, it will be worth it.”
This card will be a nice boost to the old “death by 1000 cuts” Personal Evolution decks with 18 agendas. And with only one per deck, it benefits a lot from Fast Track, even if that does telegraph your play a bit.
Rating: Over 9000
Brian: This almost feels like a Jinteki Scorched Earth. I can’t wait to have scored six 1 pointers against PE and have the Corp Fast Track this one into a HQ full of Snares and Shocks and a Trick of Light and say “your turn”…
Another point, this may be good after the corp steals only 2 or 3 agendas if you score it out early in your turn, get the extra damage from PE, and then flatline with a Neural EMP or 2. Just more options!
My rating for this card is a poem but it is a secret poem.
Chris: Wooo! Jinteki finally got a 5/3 agenda! It’s a neat one, too! It’s sort of a better version of NAPD Contract. It probably won’t cost the runner as much money, but it’s also really hard for the runner to steal. Having a 3-point agenda that actually has a good shot at not being stolen is going to be pretty neat.
Brian: The part that is better is the extra point. But that extra point can easily go to the runner. Otherwise I wouldn’t say this is a better version of NAPD. I think this comes down to how good you think you are at the Psi minigame. This is probably Jinteki’s best option for a 5/3 I suppose.
Though, in recent games, I am about 1 for 11 in actually winning the Future Perfect Psi game.
I give this Agenda Nine Helicopters out of Antelope.
Chris: Jinteki executive makes his debut! And it’s quite a debut. Effectively giving the runner 2 unpreventable brain damage is kind of amazing. Granted, the runner can reverse it if they can either trash or capture Hiro, but making runs to do so is going to be a lot less safe with him on the table. Between Hiro, and the relative ease of brain damage in H&P, I’m wondering if the “increase the runner hand size” cards will actually start to see some play.
Brian: Hiro is a lot more interesting than Haas. I am not sure how viable it would be to keep Hiro on the table but I can see some possibility combining him with brain damage and EMPs. With that 6 trash cost, I wouldn’t be entirely upset when the runner steals him. While this is a really powerful card, I don’t think we will see runners expanding their hand size until there are some more explicit benefits to a bigger hand size.
I promote Chairman Hiro to CEO Hiro as the rating for this card (is CEO better than Chairman?)
Chris: Speaking of increasing the runner’s hand size, there’s this card. On the surface, it’s basically a PAD campaign, which costs the runner one less credit to trash, and the corp two fewer credits to rez. In exchange, it gives a minor benefit to the runner. But that leads to an interesting question – is it worth it for the runner to trash, knowing that it might save their life from Jinteki damage ice? I’m honestly not sure what to think of this card. In decks without damage, it is just a cheaper PAD campaign, which the runner will trash without thought. In decks WITH damage, it might stick around longer, but only because it actually makes the runner safer.
Brian: The problem I see is you don’t want it in a flatline deck, so when the Runner sees it, they should just trash it. That means you need to defend it, meaning you need to rez some ice which will take away the economic benefit of the card. Sundew is better in terms of Assets that need Ice defense. And even if the Runner thinks they need the extra hand size, they should still trash it immediately because paying the corp a credit a turn is not worth +1 to hand size. They will use that money to flatline you! I just don’t understand where this card fits in.
It was probably included for Diversified Portfolio food.
Clinic is too confusing to rate.
Chris: This card is neat. First off, thematically, it’s fantastic. A trap that triggers when you look at it? How does that even work? Psychics!
But also, it feels like the perfect thing for Jinteki right now – With Mushin no Shin hitting the scene and making traps a lot more practical to play, expose effects are going to be more important than ever. And while Zaibatsu Loyalty covers that to some extent, it’s nice to have a reason to make the runner a little bit paranoid about just what they reveal.
And like all good Jinteki cards, it forces a hard choice on the runner. This card can never actually kill you, even with House of Knives helping out. So the fewer cards you have in your hand when you hit it, the better, right? Right. Running with fewer cards in hand is pretty much exactly what Jinteki would like you to do…
I don’t think Psychic Field will have any effect on exposing decisions because there just isn’t another option if you need to find out what a card is. And it won’t cause the Runner to run in with fewer cards just in case they hit this card. The best counter is to run early in the turn if you see these in the Corp’s deck.
Brian: Clearing all the Runner’s cards is a powerful effect and can be devastating if the Runner makes the mistake of running into this late in their turn (like I did, and then got Scorched..).
The rating for this card has been psychically delivered to you.
Chris: A new trap! Interesting to see another trap that can protect archives. Also interesting to see a trap that does more than just net damage. This is the first time we’ve seen the “negative points” mechanic, but it’s definitely an interesting one! I think I like this card for two reasons: First, it does something new and interesting. But second, because I’m secretly hoping that it will change Data Dealer into a legitimate deck include for people besides Ian Sterling…
Brian: Data Dealer just isn’t going to be a thing unless they add 10 more cards like this in the Lunar Cycle. This is a fantastic trap! It seems fairly easy to give the Runner a negative Agenda point. But how much is that worth? If the Runner has 5 cards, is it worth spending 6 to give the Runner a negative point or is it better to spend those 6 credits on advancing your own agenda points? I think you want to spend at their hand size (3 or 4) in most cases to give them the hard decision. Especially if you have a couple EMPs in hand.
Another thing to consider is if a single -1 point is going to make a difference. If you run all 2 pointer agendas, it probably won’t.
Shi.Kyu is awarded -5 out of 5.
Chris: Finally! Jinteki has needed something like this since forever. Positional ice seems to be a stronger theme than ever for Jinteki, (with the recent release of Inazuma, as well as the less recent, and less respected Marker), so it’s nice to have a practical way to rearrange it. Midori has always been an option, but the fact that she derezzes things is rough. And sunset is rarely practical. This offers a reusable way to move ice around between servers, rezzed or not, and is even high-enough trash cost that you might not even need to protect it vs. anyone except for Whizzard.
Brian: I just can’t get excited about these types of repositioning effects. Until I see a good and efficient reason to move Ice around all the time, I won’t be using Tenma Line.
Tenma Line gets 0 points but is a clone so the point value is doubled.
Chris: I think this card will see more use outside of Jinteki than in it. There simply aren’t enough ways to capitalize on tags from within faction. On the other hand, this card feels like a godsend to any scorched earth decks floating around, since, if you win the mind game, either choice is good for the corp. It will be interesting if this makes it worth trying to splash scorched earths into Jinteki.
Brian: This is a fun card. When this is played on you, you have to be HIGHLY suspicious. What exactly is going on here? It actually seems pretty decent played within Jinteki without anything specific to use the tag for but is better if you have some tag punishment.
My brain tells me this card is rated 18.
Chris: “Cards that are awesome but also help the runner” seems to be Jinteki’s new theme. Or maybe their old theme, since Celebrity Gifts was clearly cut from the same cloth. Hard to say if this will turn into a staple econ card, or if it will end up like Successful Demonstration, and only see play in a few specialized decks. A restructuring you can play from only 3 credits is nothing to sneeze at though, and as a one-influence transaction operation, we might start seeing this in Weyland as well.
Brian: Weyland usually doesn’t want the Runner to get credits but gaining 6 while the Runner gains 3 seems like a viable ratio. I had this played against me a couple days ago and I was quite happy to get 3 credits for free. I think that Cerebral Imaging might like this one as that is another big burst of money to help with the combo and they don’t care too much if the Runner gets some money.
I do want to encourage everyone to continue believing that Successful Demonstration is a specialized card that nobody should consider using so I can continue to exploit it.
This card is rated 5 but it also bumps up another cards rating by 3.
Chris: Personal prediction: This card is going to shake up the meta by itself. The biggest problem with playing shell games with advanceable traps is just how many resources you have to spend advancing them. This card removes a huge amount of that cost, effectively saving you 2 clicks and 3 credits. And possibly even more importantly, it gives you a plausible reason to have triple-advanced, undefended assets on the table, making dangerous traps that much harder to tell apart from legitimate assets. I think this card will, by itself, be responsible for a lot more expose effects in runner decks.
Brian: This is the best Jerry, the best! I have been using this in my Tennin deck with Ronin, Secretary, and Refinery to great effect. It also makes the prospect of scoring a Fetal AI more viable. I have had people draw up to 6 cards and run. Everyone thinks it is a Junebug for some reason.
Mushin No Shin gets all the ratings for 0 credits.
Chris: Oh boy, here it is. The scariest new piece of ice in a while. It is probably the most threatening code gate around, since if you can’t break it, it guarantees a hit from whatever nasty thing is behind it. It’s a good way to get a second hit out of a nasty sentry, even if the runner thinks they’re ready for it. Runners have to respect Jinteki ice defenses, even if they have a sentry breaker installed.
I’m secretly hoping that this card will signal the beginning of the end of Yog.0’s dominance, since between this and RSVP, we’re starting to get a good spread of low-cost codegates that Yog can’t break unless it has datasucker support, or is sitting on a dinosaur.
Brian: I definitely switched away from Yog because of this card. I have been playing with Inazuma and am convinced it is one of the best Ice in the game. Like all positional Ice, it can be disabled with a well timed Parasite. But my plan of Unrezzed Inazuma->Mystery Ice->Rototurret worked pretty well when after the Rototurret was Parasited, I rezzed the Inazuma and second Rototurret to kill a Corroder. Inazuma is really expensive to break once you hit them with something nasty as well.
A friend couldn’t figure out why everyone loved Inazuma and then realized it was 3 to rez (after thinking it was 5) and said “Oh, yeah, that is pretty great”.
Best Ice in the pack. Rating is 110%.
Chris: Recently, Jinteki seems to be getting a lot of ice that is low strength, but has TONS of subroutines. Which is an interesting direction to take, since it means that the runner is going to be more likely to be able to get up to strength, but is going to spend a lot of cash on all the subs. Case in point, this beauty: It will never actually KILL the runner (unless there is an active House of Knives) but it will do a lot of damage, and basically force any sane runner to jack out, for fear of data mines, Hokusai grids, Shocks, Snares, and Fetal AIs. It’s brutally expensive to break, too, although it shares Tsurugi’s weakness to parasites. And it offers the runner an amusing choice: It would be so much cheaper to break, if they’d just run with fewer cards in their hand…
Brian: Like you say, Parasite is really the deciding factor here. There are decks that will want to pay extra for this effect but in most cases I think you want to go with Katana. The problem I see is that Katana is good because it punishes early game face checking. This also punishes face checking but is just a bit more expensive for a similar effect. It is a decent option I suppose.
My rating is based on the number of cards in your hand right now.
Chris: So adorable! This is some of the best taxing ice we’ve seen since Eli and Popup Window. It’s super cheap to rez. And it’s super easy for the runner to bypass. But it’s going to cost them 2 credits. Every. Single. Time. For reference, Eli costs the corp 3 to rez, and usually costs most runners 4 credits to break. That 3:4 ratio is part of what makes Eli so amazing. Ice that costs the runner more to break than it costs the corp to rez is pretty rare. Well, this little beauty has a 1:2 ratio, putting it ahead of basically anything this side of popup window. I think he’ll be seeing a lot of play. Both inside of Jinteki, and (at 1 influence) outside, for any corp that wants to splash some top-notch ice tax into their decks.
Brian: I agree with your assessment. If you were using Popup in your Jinteki deck mostly for the annoyance/tax, Pup is a good way to save some influence and double the effect! Pup is also immune to Yog.
Rating: 1 or a net damage, you choose.
Chris: I don’t know what to think of this card. On one hand, I like the fact that it’s a 5 strength code gate. Take that Yog! But on the other hand, 6 to rez is kind of pricey for something that doesn’t even end the run. It’s basically Yagura’s big brother, but it’s not clear that the upgrade is worth it. It depends heavily on traps in your deck to be a threat, and the worst you are going to do with it is 3 damage. (Since you can’t use Shi.Kyu from R&D) Maybe it’s worth putting on a non-R&D server, just for the mini-precognition every time the runner crashes through? Hard to say.
Brian: This doesn’t seem that good. The best thing I can think to say about it is that it makes good Indexing defense maybe? If your Jinteki deck has infinite money for some reason, this is worth looking at.
Rating: It is an Ice.
Chris: Jinteki gets a unique deity themed ice! I know a lot of people (myself included) were hoping for a Yamato-no-Orochi ice (come on, Jinteki needs their snake!) but this is at least thematically related. It’s not quite as pricey for the runner as Wotan, but it’s also not quite as costly to rez, either. (And it’s still a 7 strength sentry, which is nothing to sneeze at.) It’s usually just an end-the-run piece of ice, but if your archives are full of shocks and shi.kyus, then it has the potential to be a bit more annoying. Pity it’s so susceptible to Femme Fatale, but it’s hard to complain too much, if the only good counter is for the runner to install a 9-cost program…
Brian: My Cell Portal senses are tingling…
People are going to have intricate plans based around this Ice and then I will just run in with a Faerie and they will be sad. Also, in a recent game, this got rezzed in front of me. I was forced to run into archives and only gain a credit and a data sucker token. It was shutdown later that game. All for the low, low cost of 9!
Rating: 9 credits is too expensive for ETR.
Chris: I’m torn on this one. On one hand, it’s usually going to be a less reliable PAD-campaign, that costs slightly more to rez and trash. On the other hand, being an upgrade means that, unlike pad campaign and other economic assets, this can share a server with your agendas, so you don’t have to spend extra ice protecting it, if you meet a runner who is willing to trash your things. And on the third hand, it does have at least the potential to give you double money with Matrix Analyzer. Hard to say.
Brian: You do not have 3 hands. 5 trash cost is the best part about this card. It is probably best in Tennin. The limit of only being used on cards within the server is less than ideal though. This seems like it could be useful now but probably not useful enough to justify the card slot.
My rating for this card is: Neat art!
Chris: Sorry HB, Jinteki is sort of the brain damage faction now. She’s kind of pricey, (2 to rez, and another 2 to apply the damage) but she’s pretty worth it, particularly on a server they’re going to have to run more than once. (i. e. HQ or R&D) She combos well with Caprice and Ash, who give her multiple chances to work her particular brand of brain-magic. House of Knives, Data Mine, and Hokusai Grid are all her friends.
Rating: NOT MY BRAIN!
Chris: The first neutral trap! I’m not a fan. While it looks neat on the surface, (and being able to set it off for zero credits is cool) it feels really hard to actually land. Even ignoring the requirement that you actually have an agenda in your hand to use it, it’s just too rare for the corp to actually have a 3-advanced asset on the board that is an agenda. Even for 5-cost agendas, most corps won’t advance them past 2, until they’re ready to score them out. Mushin no Shin is probably the only way you’re going to get this to land, since it’s the only real case where you might have a lightly-defended 3-cost agenda on the board.
Brian: I love the dream play of scoring the first Medical Breakthrough/Nisei out of hand after a Mushin No Shin and advance on Plan B. Outside of that, there are better traps.
Rating: Skip ahead to Plan C.
Chris: Huh. Neat. Seems a bit specific in its ability, but still it’s nice to have a direct counter to inside job as well as the new Feint. Too bad Femme Fatale can just break it for 1 credit.
Brian: This is an extremely good early game Ice. Want a turn 3 Astro or Nisei scored? Install this turn 2 in a remote with the agenda and hope they don’t have a Faerie in hand. This simply increases the chances that you can score out an important agenda in the early game. It is also decent on HQ if you have another ice above or below it so that a single Faerie can’t get through to HQ.
It’s odd that Guard is a Sentry. It feels more like a Barrier or Code Gate to me.
Rating: You may not pass!
Chris: I think this card is neat, but it feels a little pricey for what it does. While I like the idea of a 3-cost ice that costs 3-4 to break with most breakers, it’s hard not to compare it to Bastion, which only costs the corp one more credit, and is far more restrictive on which breakers it allows.
Brian: Not a big fan. When I see cards like this I go back to Eli. Just use Eli. It is worth the influence and is more taxing.
Rating: Just use Eli.
Chris: I want to like this card. It has a lot of potential for horizontal decks with lots of assets. But it also feels sort of like a “win-more” card. If you’ve got a ton of assets, they’re probably already providing you with a lot of money, so your need for this card is lessened. If you DON’T have many assets, say, because mean runners keep trashing all your beautiful PAD campaigns and sundews, then this card isn’t going to help you much. I’m willing to reserve judgement until I actually get a chance to try it in some decks, but at first glance it seems a little weak, given that you need 4 assets on the board to make it even match Beanstalk Royalties.
Brian: Totally agree. It is worth noting that the cards in the remotes don’t need to be assets and they don’t need to rezzed. Maybe there is potential for early game abuse with Mirrormorph.
I rate this 7 because I was told it is good to have a diversified portfolio by some smarty pants business person once.
Chris: Choo choo! All aboard the Astroscript train!
Brian: While obviously great for Fast Advance, it is worth mentioning some more use cases. First of all, Jinteki can use this to great effect. Celebrity Gifts, show them a nasty hand of traps, click 3 Fast Track for an Agenda, come and get it Runner. It is also good for acquiring a 4/2 and getting it into scoring position when you have a solid window.
This gets 3 out of 3 trains.